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cell phone use in hospitals

Discussion in 'alt.cellular.verizon' started by maryann, Nov 18, 2003.

  1. Steve B

    Steve B Guest

    Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    Regarding top-posting versus bottom-posting, I share the same sentiment as
    Dr WireMORE. I find that I have to spend unnecessary time following
    threads, as folks often leave too much information within the posts
    (regardless of whether or not they top- or bottom-post). I am already
    following whatever thread is in question, so having to scroll through text
    that I've already read consumes my time.



    I also agree with Joseph's posting that it appears that top-posters often
    "post and dump", as it is easy to do (as in email).



    I wish DevilsPGD the best in his endeavors, and accept that he and I have
    differing opinions. I do not believe posting is as dichotomous as "top" or
    "bottom", but rather whatever best fits the situation.



    I am now leaving this thread as in the end, folks are going to post as they
    choose. Good luck to all!



    › See More: cell phone use in hospitals
  2. Quick

    Quick Guest

    Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    Steve B wrote:
    >
    > I wish DevilsPGD the best in his endeavors, and accept that he and I
    > have differing opinions. I do not believe posting is as dichotomous
    > as "top" or "bottom", but rather whatever best fits the situation.


    Could you please repeat what DevilsPGD endeavors were?
    I must have missed that one.

    -Quick
  3. Al Klein

    Al Klein Guest

    Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 14:03:29 GMT, "dr.wireMORE"
    <dr.wireMORE@VZW-MidWESTma.com> said in alt.cellular:

    >While I might miss out on some information, I use a pre-view screen.
    >Pre-view appears to support top-posting, the most new/relevant information
    >on top. But if someone would contact the developers and have the preview
    >window start at the "bottom" or last item, then I'd add my comments at the
    >bottom.


    Could you name some news clients that have "preview screens"?
  4. David S

    David S Guest

    Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 21:26:23 GMT, "John Richards" <jr70@blackhole.invalid>
    chose to add this to the great equation of life, the universe, and
    everything:

    >X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180
    >
    >"David S" <dwstreeter@spamisnaughty.att.net> wrote in message news:nkgto01e7ndp63n7rfv85s3pfhgjh744f7@4ax.com...
    >> P.P.S. To whoever it is who keeps mentioning fitting on one screen, not all
    >> screens are the same and the examples you are citing of fitting on one
    >> screen don't in my reader.

    >
    >Yep, it's a judgment call. For me, the preview screen shows about 31 lines.
    >YMMV. If a post shows nothing but old quoted text for the first 31 lines, I'll
    >skip it and go on to the next. Life is too short to waste it by scrolling
    >Usenet posts.


    Otoh, I use a *real* newsreader, Forte Agent, instead of Outlook Depress.
    Agent features "single key read" which lets me advance one whole screenful
    with a single press of the spacebar (or whatever key I specify).

    --
    David Streeter, "an internet god" -- Dave Barry
    http://home.att.net/~dwstreeter
    Remove the naughty bit from my address to reply
    Expect a train on ANY track at ANY time.
    "I was Miss Congeniality at the Miss Teenage America Pageant. I don't tell
    that to many people - I've always felt that it was so embarrassing. But
    really - that's who I am. That's me." - Cybill Shepherd
  5. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    David S burbled to the world:

    > Otoh, I use a *real* newsreader, Forte Agent, instead of Outlook
    > Depress. Agent features "single key read" which lets me advance one
    > whole screenful with a single press of the spacebar (or whatever key
    > I specify).


    The spacebar does that in OE, too.

    What kind of self righteousness does it take for you to deride
    the most popular program in its area as not "real"? You can like it or
    not, but it's real, I assure you.

    Chris

    --

    If all else fails, immortality can always be assured by spectacular
    error.
    John Kenneth Galbraith
  6. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Scott Stephenson" <scott.stephensonson@adelphia.net> wrote in message news:QN6dnex77YojuQ3cRVn-pg@adelphia.com...
    >
    > "John Richards" <jr70@blackhole.invalid> wrote in message
    > news:v4Ojd.17383$Rf1.12451@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...
    >> "Al Klein" <rukbat@verizon.org> wrote in message

    > news:h1mto051l3b218ghgpof3039heuatl1nut@4ax.com...
    >> > On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 06:33:53 GMT, "John Richards"
    >> > <jr70@blackhole.invalid> said in alt.cellular:
    >> >
    >> >>"Al Klein" <rukbat@verizon.org> wrote in message

    > news:rd4ro0h37rukbe1e6i9r9ivreui8lhnli1@4ax.com...
    >> >>> On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 01:18:35 GMT, "John Richards"
    >> >>> <jr70@blackhole.invalid> said in alt.cellular:
    >> >
    >> >>>>Take a look at the Microsoft newsgroups on the NNTP server

    > msnews.microsoft.com.
    >> >>>>More than 90% of the posts there are top-posted
    >> >
    >> >>> Good argument - against top posting.
    >> >
    >> >>Guess you missed reading the part where I said it was working out
    >> >>well for them, and that they're not clueless newbies.
    >> >
    >> > I saw it. If MS "sets a standard", that's a good reason to think that
    >> > there's at least one flaw with the "standard". Anything they set.
    >> > Just look at their "flavor of the week" OSs. Windows ME, anyone?

    >>
    >> Customers vote with their dollars. It may be 'cool' in certain circles to
    >> be anti-MS, but the fact remains that their OS is on 95% of all personal
    >> computers. As such, they are a force to be reckoned with, and can't be
    >> ignored.
    >>

    > Pretty shitty analogy. Over 95% of cars run on gasoline- that doesn't make
    > the Saudis experts on motor vehicle regulations. Over 95% of the computers
    > in my community run on electricity provided by the local utility- that
    > doesn't make them experts on computer technology. Both are a force to be
    > reckoned with and can't be ignored.


    If you're trying to say that Microsoft has no input in setting computer
    standards, I think you're wrong. They are represented on a lot of standard
    making committees.

    > Let's see if using your own analogy makes any sense to you- roughly 90% of
    > the people posting in this thread are telling you top posting is not the
    > accepted standard.


    And 90% of the posters in Microsoft newsgroups top-post, what does that
    tell you?

    --
    John Richards
  7. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Scott Stephenson" <scott.stephensonson@adelphia.net> wrote in message news:9aadnWzUpdfLuA3cRVn-oQ@adelphia.com...
    >
    > "John Richards" <jr70@blackhole.invalid> wrote in message
    > news:1BOjd.17392$Rf1.5764@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...
    >> "Scott Stephenson" <scott.stephensonson@adelphia.net> wrote in message

    > news:lI-dnUvCfcIB3RPcRVn-sw@adelphia.com...
    >> >
    >> > "John Richards" <jr70@blackhole.invalid> wrote in message
    >> > news:LJejd.3058$0A3.2323@newssvr16.news.prodigy.com...
    >> >
    >> >>
    >> >> Standards are not set in concrete.
    >> >
    >> > True, but when presented with the standards that well over half post

    > here
    >> > with, you took the attitude of ,"f*** them all, I'll do what I want."

    > Very
    >> > poor etiquette and it shows a lack of consideration.

    >>
    >> You're grossly mischaracterizing my position. As I've stated before,
    >> when I reply to a post I'll use whatever convention is already in use
    >> for that thread, eventhough I prefer top-posting.
    >> When in Rome, do as the Romans...
    >>
    >> --

    > You know what, John- I'll give you that one. And looking at your posts
    > indicates that you have done just that. And for that you get an apology.


    Accepted. And for the record, I have no beef with bottom-posted
    messages as long as excess quoted text is snipped out.

    --
    John Richards
  8. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Scott Stephenson" <scott.stephensonson@adelphia.net> wrote in message news:4YSdnWCDOLoNrQ3cRVn-tw@adelphia.com...
    >
    > "Steve B" <netuser49@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    > news:WeWjd.9579$Gm6.4003@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net...
    >> I hate having to scroll when bottom-posters do not snip the unimportant
    >> parts of a posting...
    >>
    >>

    > Yep- almost as annoying as those that snip the whole post to lose all points
    > of reference.


    Indeed. I see that a lot with AOL posters.

    --
    John Richards
  9. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Al Klein" <rukbat@verizon.org> wrote in message news:5uc0p0d64tdjcg1098aa34ddmlhmcn0sei@4ax.com...
    > On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 17:32:11 GMT, "John Richards"
    > <jr70@blackhole.invalid> said in alt.cellular:
    >
    >> It may be 'cool' in certain circles to
    >>be anti-MS, but the fact remains that their OS is on 95% of all personal
    >>computers. As such, they are a force to be reckoned with, and can't be
    >>ignored.

    >
    > As an OS, yes. As apps, yes. That still doesn't make them a
    > standards committee.


    You don't think MS sits on a lot of standards committees?
    Regardless of that point, it is indisputable that MS encourages
    top-posting in their own newsgroups. I've been an MS beta tester
    for almost 10 years now, and get to spend a lot of time in
    their newsgroups.

    --
    John Richards
  10. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Al Klein" <rukbat@verizon.org> wrote in message news:77i0p0hiks2d9nb144pglha4i51vmjdkab@4ax.com...
    > On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 18:06:53 GMT, "John Richards"
    > <jr70@blackhole.invalid> said in alt.cellular:
    >
    >>You're grossly mischaracterizing my position. As I've stated before,
    >>when I reply to a post I'll use whatever convention is already in use
    >>for that thread, eventhough I prefer top-posting.
    >>When in Rome, do as the Romans...

    >
    > The majority of "Romans" bottom post.


    In non-MS newsgroups, yes. That said, I've seen the percentage
    of top-posted Usenet messages steadily increase over the last
    few years. It's a trend that can't be denied.

    --
    John Richards
  11. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Al Klein" <rukbat@verizon.org> wrote in message news:m8i0p0h2ggrc8gbemjaou51ibivv7qov9p@4ax.com...
    > On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 21:26:23 GMT, "John Richards"
    > <jr70@blackhole.invalid> said in alt.cellular:
    >
    >>Yep, it's a judgment call. For me, the preview screen shows about 31 lines.
    >>YMMV. If a post shows nothing but old quoted text for the first 31 lines, I'll
    >>skip it and go on to the next. Life is too short to waste it by scrolling
    >>Usenet posts.

    >
    > Very few news readers (if any) have "preview screens", unless you
    > count the topic as a preview.


    That's the advantage of the three-paned preview screen in MS-OE.
    I don't have to 'open' a message to see its contents.

    --
    John Richards
  12. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "DevilsPGD" <devilspgd@crazyhat.net> wrote in message news:h0k0p0ljppbo8jtdng48sg49du1r79sr15@news.supernews.com...
    > In message <m8i0p0h2ggrc8gbemjaou51ibivv7qov9p@4ax.com> Al Klein
    > <rukbat@verizon.org> wrote:
    >
    >>>Yep, it's a judgment call. For me, the preview screen shows about 31 lines.
    >>>YMMV. If a post shows nothing but old quoted text for the first 31 lines, I'll
    >>>skip it and go on to the next. Life is too short to waste it by scrolling
    >>>Usenet posts.

    >>
    >>Very few news readers (if any) have "preview screens", unless you
    >>count the topic as a preview.

    >
    > And some of those that do can be made to collapse quotes anyway, so you
    > get to see the new content right away, without breaking the discussion.


    Really? Which news readers have that option? Sounds like the best of
    both conventions.

    --
    John Richards
  13. Quick

    Quick Guest

    Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    John Richards wrote:
    >
    > And 90% of the posters in Microsoft newsgroups top-post, what does
    > that tell you?


    I don't know. Maybe only that most of them use Outlook and OE, which
    encourage top posting by putting the cursor at the top when you reply?
    Might not tell you anything more than that.

    -Quick
  14. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Joseph" <JoeOfSeattle@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:4802p09uljkk4j6goc4lepbv088digfmpn@4ax.com...
    > On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 02:49:26 GMT, "Steve B" <netuser49@hotmail.com>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>I hate having to scroll when bottom-posters do not snip the unimportant
    >>parts of a posting...

    >
    > I hate having to scroll when top posters do not snip the unimportant
    > parts of a posting!


    Why should you have to scroll at all in such a circumstance?
    That is precisely the advantage of top-posting.

    --
    John Richards
  15. Quick

    Quick Guest

    Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    John Richards wrote:
    > "Al Klein" <rukbat@verizon.org> wrote in message
    > news:5uc0p0d64tdjcg1098aa34ddmlhmcn0sei@4ax.com...
    >> On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 17:32:11 GMT, "John Richards"
    >> <jr70@blackhole.invalid> said in alt.cellular:
    >>
    >>> It may be 'cool' in certain circles to
    >>> be anti-MS, but the fact remains that their OS is on 95% of all
    >>> personal computers. As such, they are a force to be reckoned with,
    >>> and can't be ignored.

    >>
    >> As an OS, yes. As apps, yes. That still doesn't make them a
    >> standards committee.

    >
    > You don't think MS sits on a lot of standards committees?


    They are a large corporation. They will be involved in the standards
    community. They will try to influence standards bodies in directions
    favorable to them as a business. All companies do that.

    > Regardless of that point, it is indisputable that MS encourages
    > top-posting in their own newsgroups. I've been an MS beta tester
    > for almost 10 years now, and get to spend a lot of time in
    > their newsgroups.


    Again, I would guess that most of them are using Outlook and OE
    which encourage top posting by their design. Why were they designed
    or implemented that way? Who knows? Maybe the engineer(s) who
    implemented that functionality had no history, flipped a coin, or it was
    their preference? These things happen. Maybe there was a technical
    product reason for it. This may result in its being pushed, commonly
    used, steam rolled into convention, but it is not a justification (i
    think?).
    By the way, I use Outlook and OE.

    -Quick
  16. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Al Klein" <rukbat@verizon.org> wrote in message news:1p23p05592ilsjra0sqbqa3vc930qkm5od@4ax.com...
    > On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 14:03:29 GMT, "dr.wireMORE"
    > <dr.wireMORE@VZW-MidWESTma.com> said in alt.cellular:
    >
    >>While I might miss out on some information, I use a pre-view screen.
    >>Pre-view appears to support top-posting, the most new/relevant information
    >>on top. But if someone would contact the developers and have the preview
    >>window start at the "bottom" or last item, then I'd add my comments at the
    >>bottom.

    >
    > Could you name some news clients that have "preview screens"?


    The one that is on more computers than any other, Outlook Express, has
    the three-pane preview screen, making it very convenient to quickly skim
    through message after message (unless one of those messages has a lot
    of preceding quoted material).

    --
    John Richards
  17. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "David S" <dwstreeter@spamisnaughty.att.net> wrote in message news:cvm2p0dhomfkgf9jm627mddl90h42r37fj@4ax.com...
    > On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 21:26:23 GMT, "John Richards" <jr70@blackhole.invalid>
    > chose to add this to the great equation of life, the universe, and
    > everything:
    >
    >>X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180
    >>
    >>"David S" <dwstreeter@spamisnaughty.att.net> wrote in message news:nkgto01e7ndp63n7rfv85s3pfhgjh744f7@4ax.com...
    >>> P.P.S. To whoever it is who keeps mentioning fitting on one screen, not all
    >>> screens are the same and the examples you are citing of fitting on one
    >>> screen don't in my reader.

    >>
    >>Yep, it's a judgment call. For me, the preview screen shows about 31 lines.
    >>YMMV. If a post shows nothing but old quoted text for the first 31 lines, I'll
    >>skip it and go on to the next. Life is too short to waste it by scrolling
    >>Usenet posts.

    >
    > Otoh, I use a *real* newsreader, Forte Agent, instead of Outlook Depress.
    > Agent features "single key read" which lets me advance one whole screenful
    > with a single press of the spacebar (or whatever key I specify).


    If I was so inclined I could page through a lengthy post with OE by simply
    hitting the "Page Dn" key (which is a lot more intuitive), but frankly,
    I'm not so inclined. Posters who overquote tend to be lamers anyway.

    --
    John Richards
  18. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Chris Pisarra" <Chris@Pisarra.com> wrote in message news:Y0rkd.390727$D%.161385@attbi_s51...
    > David S burbled to the world:
    >
    >> Otoh, I use a *real* newsreader, Forte Agent, instead of Outlook
    >> Depress. Agent features "single key read" which lets me advance one
    >> whole screenful with a single press of the spacebar (or whatever key
    >> I specify).

    >
    > The spacebar does that in OE, too.


    Nice catch. I didn't know it could do that.

    > What kind of self righteousness does it take for you to deride
    > the most popular program in its area as not "real"? You can like it or
    > not, but it's real, I assure you.


    Indeed. OE may not be greatest at handling binaries, but for text
    newsgroups like this one it is second to none.

    --
    John Richards
  19. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "Quick" <quick7135-news@NOSPAMyahoo.com> wrote in message news:1100122720.152587@sj-nntpcache-5...
    > John Richards wrote:
    >>
    >> And 90% of the posters in Microsoft newsgroups top-post, what does
    >> that tell you?

    >
    > I don't know. Maybe only that most of them use Outlook and OE, which
    > encourage top posting by putting the cursor at the top when you reply?
    > Might not tell you anything more than that.


    Perhaps true for newbies. But it is easy enough to move the insertion
    point to the bottom, as I do most of the time. When non-newbies
    like myself top-post, it is because we're tired of having to scroll
    through more than a screenful of prior quoted text.

    --
    John Richards
  20. Re: Top posting (Was: cell phone use in hospitals)

    "John Richards" <jr70@blackhole.invalid> wrote:

    >Indeed. OE may not be greatest at handling binaries, but for text
    >newsgroups like this one it is second to none.


    Having used OE and Agent and a few others for many years, I would say OE is
    definitely second to many, if not most.

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