Tri-band phones?

What exactly are tri-band phones?

Verizon still carries a few tri-band (or tri-mode) phones (e.g., LG
VX4650, LG VX3300, LG VX5200). I was told that these phones can still
use the the old analog network (as opposed to digital CDMA) in areas
where there is no CDMA coverage? Is this correct?

If so, I'd be interested to get a tri-band phone, unless there are some
other disadvantages to them.

Are there any other tri-band phones?
What are some of the areas (geographies) where these phones may be useful?

While at it, what are the other "dual band" phones? Just digital CDMA
with two frequencies?

Thanks for help!

XY, Seattle, WA

 

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:21:27 -0700, XY <xy@z.com> wrote:

>What exactly are tri-band phones?

The proper term is tri-mode. Two of the modes operate in the same
band.

>Verizon still carries a few tri-band (or tri-mode) phones (e.g., LG
>VX4650, LG VX3300, LG VX5200). I was told that these phones can still
>use the the old analog network (as opposed to digital CDMA) in areas
>where there is no CDMA coverage? Is this correct?

I'm not familiar with LG phones specifically, but yes, if one of the
modes is AMPS, then that is the analog network.

>If so, I'd be interested to get a tri-band phone, unless there are some
>other disadvantages to them.

I think the advantages outweigh any possible disadvantages. And I'm
not sure there are any disadvantages to a tri-mode.

>Are there any other tri-band phones?

I'm sure there are some, but most newer ones omit analog. Cell
operators would like to shut down the remaining AMPS channels so they
can be used for higher capacity digital service.

>What are some of the areas (geographies) where these phones may be useful?

Rural areas, mostly, although most "rural" areas have digital coverage
of some sort.

>While at it, what are the other "dual band" phones? Just digital CDMA
>with two frequencies?

Not two frequencies, but two bands. A band is comprised of hundreds
of frequencies. Dual-band VZW phones operate in the 800Mhz and
1900Mhz bands. AMPS also operates in the 800Mhz band.

 

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:21:27 -0700, XY <xy@z.com> wrote:

>What exactly are tri-band phones?
>
>Verizon still carries a few tri-band (or tri-mode) phones (e.g., LG
>VX4650, LG VX3300, LG VX5200). I was told that these phones can still
>use the the old analog network (as opposed to digital CDMA) in areas
>where there is no CDMA coverage? Is this correct?

yup. great for travelers like us. we spend 4-6 months a year
traveling in our RV. some of the places we visit have an analog only
signal.

>If so, I'd be interested to get a tri-band phone, unless there are some
>other disadvantages to them.

not that i can see.
>
>Are there any other tri-band phones?

v260/262, v265/266/276

>What are some of the areas (geographies) where these phones may be useful?
>
>While at it, what are the other "dual band" phones? Just digital CDMA
>with two frequencies?


73,
rich, n9dko

 

XY wrote:
> What exactly are tri-band phones?
>
>
> If so, I'd be interested to get a tri-band phone, unless there are some
> other disadvantages to them.

I use tri-mode on motorcycle for rural areas. Most times I've needed to
call, I was covered by digital network. I have not yet broken done and
been out of range. The only disadvantage I see is that if NO cell
service available, they use a lot of power while searching. I turn mine
off in Adirondacks and other areas where I expect service to be limited
or leave it plugged into charger.
>
> Are there any other tri-band phones?
> What are some of the areas (geographies) where these phones may be useful?
>
> While at it, what are the other "dual band" phones? Just digital CDMA
> with two frequencies?
>
> Thanks for help!
>
> XY, Seattle, WA

 

> On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:21:27 -0700, XY <xy@z.com> wrote:
>

>
>> If so, I'd be interested to get a tri-band phone, unless there are
>> some other disadvantages to them.
>

If you don't need the coverage in some rural areas, your battery lasts a
whole lot longer, and you can do data (possible to do on analog, but slower
than a snail and needs extra equipment)... With some phones, the voicemail
indicator won't work correctly in analog areas.

 

"Stonecritter" <Stonecritter@stny.rr.com> wrote in message
news:UfzHg.28226$8j3.20781@twister.nyroc.rr.com...

> I use tri-mode on motorcycle for rural areas.
>>
>> XY, Seattle, WA


That must be exciting-- talking while riding ;-)

Doug

 

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:21:27 -0700, XY <xy@z.com> wrote:

>Verizon still carries a few tri-band (or tri-mode) phones (e.g., LG
>VX4650, LG VX3300, LG VX5200). I was told that these phones can still
>use the the old analog network (as opposed to digital CDMA) in areas
>where there is no CDMA coverage? Is this correct?

Yup. Not all of Verizon's extended network (partner systems) is
digital.

And with such services as Cingular - their all digital GSM network -
if you can't find a GSM signal, you're phone won't work. No analog
backup.

>
>If so, I'd be interested to get a tri-band phone, unless there are some
>other disadvantages to them.

None as far as I know. They use CDMA digital first, and analog as a
last resort.

>Are there any other tri-band phones?

I have a Motorola V325. I could have gotten a different phone, but I
wanted the tri-mode backup. I do on occasion go away from the city and
its nice to have the phone work.

I've been to the visitor's centers of Mt. Rainier and Mt. St. Helens
in Washington state. Guess what? Yup, I got an analog signal and I
could make calls, just because I wanted to do it.

>What are some of the areas (geographies) where these phones may be useful?

Western states away from the interstates. Most of the east coast went
fully digital about 2 to 3 years ago (VZW bought out an old mom and
pop system in northwest Virginia and converted it to digital). Alltel,
one of VZW's extended network partners, finally went all digtial here
in the east coast about a year ago. (Ocracoke Island in NC was analog
in 2004, but when I was there in May 2006 it was now digital)

>While at it, what are the other "dual band" phones? Just digital CDMA
>with two frequencies?

850 MHz - original cellular bands (A & B)

1900 MHz - "PCS" bands (Personal Communications Services) - all
digital. Bands "C" through "F". They aren't congituous bands either.

Go to http://www.tk.com and explore there if you want to get
technical.

Dave



>Thanks for help!
>
>XY, Seattle, WA

 

<none@none.net> wrote in message
news:6rf0f257e45djpndbk3p6k25bjqa25k6g0@4ax.com...
> There are only two bands of frequencies for wireless telephony:
> 800-900 MHtz (Old Cellular - 1980s) and 1800-1900 MHtz (PCS - Personal
> Communications Service - 1990s vintage) . So the most any phone can
> have is TWO BANDS.

I understand what the poster here is trying to say but there is a serious
error with this statement. I own at least two phones that are quad-band and
several that are tri-band. The quad-band phones are either 850/900/1800/1900
GSM or 900/1800/1900 GSM plus UMTS-2100. The tri-band phones are all
900/1800/1900 GSM. The poster (none) is correct that there are currently
only really two cellular bands used IN THE USA. However other bands are used
globally and in the case of the phones listed above the 900/1800 and 2100
bands are not used in the USA. Now, things are going to get more complicated
in the US and mobile phones used here may be dual, tri or even quad band
before very much longer, although the new bands will be even different from
those listed above. As for the single, dual or tri-mode issue, "mode" is a
marketing buzz-word. I wouldn't bother getting into an argument over it.

--
Donald R. Newcomb
DRNewcomb (at) attglobal (dot) net

 

Donald Newcomb wrote:
> As for the single, dual or tri-mode issue, "mode" is a
> marketing buzz-word. I wouldn't bother getting into an argument over it.

I wouldn't either, exactly, except to suggest that most comm engineers
would make the distinction that "band" refers to frequency, while "mode"
refers to modulation method, and has since long before the marketers
ever got ahold of it.

--
St. John
"We don't care. We don't have to. We're the Phone Company."

 

Douglas C. Neidermeyer wrote:
> "Stonecritter" <Stonecritter@stny.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:UfzHg.28226$8j3.20781@twister.nyroc.rr.com...
>
>
>>I use tri-mode on motorcycle for rural areas.
>>
>>>XY, Seattle, WA
>
>
>
> That must be exciting-- talking while riding ;-)
>
> Doug
>
>
Got it in case of breakdown. My bike too loud to allow it. However, with
Bluetooth headset on new phone might be possible, but not likely I'll do it.

 

On Sat, 26 Aug 2006 09:14:03 -0400, Diamond Dave wrote:

>Most of the east coast went
>fully digital about 2 to 3 years ago (VZW bought out an old mom and
>pop system in northwest Virginia and converted it to digital). Alltel,
>one of VZW's extended network partners, finally went all digtial here
>in the east coast about a year ago. (Ocracoke Island in NC was analog
>in 2004, but when I was there in May 2006 it was now digital)

I'm not arguing with MOST ... indeed, probalby over 99% based on
pupulation density. However, I (Alltel subscriber) and 2 business
associates (one Verizon, one Cingular) were together on a trip last
week into northwestern NC, just west of I77. Cingular had nothing at
all. Verizon (AC2 plan) lost coverage about 2 miles from our
destination. I, with analog (old Startac) had coverage for the day at
the customer in Ronda NC, 4 miles from I77. Some of it was CDMA (SID
309, I believe; I looked and forgot to write it down) but they are not
on the AC2 list (indeed, not on the National Freedom plan, either), I
had a solid Rm, a less and less common situation. Total Freedom lacks
some nice features, but it is the best I've seen at working
everywhere. I'm not sure if it is available to new subscribers.

I prefer the term dual mode, dual band ... and will not, by choice, be
without it. The main reason I still have the StarTac is the higher
transmit power on analog, although battery life is short in that
situation. I keep a battery on charge in the car ...

One of these days, I'll have to downgrade to a new phone, but it will
be an unhappy day. I see areas of analog 2 or 3 times a week now.

George

 

On Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:33:56 -0600, Dave Rudisill <denali@alaska.net>
wrote:

>>"Peter Pan" <PeterPanNOSPAM@AkamailNOSPAM.com> wrote:
>
>>> On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:21:27 -0700, XY <xy@z.com> wrote:
>>>
>>
>>>
>>>> If so, I'd be interested to get a tri-band phone, unless there are
>>>> some other disadvantages to them.
>>>
>>
>>If you don't need the coverage in some rural areas, your battery lasts a
>>whole lot longer, and you can do data (possible to do on analog, but slower
>>than a snail and needs extra equipment)... With some phones, the voicemail
>>indicator won't work correctly in analog areas.
>>
>
>Worse yet, we have been in a couple of analog areas in which we couldn't
>even GET our voice mail.
>
>*86 didn't work, of course, but when I tried dialing our own number I
>got a busy signal! If our other cell phone had been a tri-mode, we could
>have used it to call our number, then use the # key to get in to voice
>mail. Alas, it is a digital-only PDA/phone.
>
>One tri-mode phone is a necessity. Two is better.

interesting. whenever i want to check voice mail on my cell i usually
just dial my cell number. never fails to work, at least so far.

73,
rich, n9dko

 

On Sun, 27 Aug 2006 11:45:59 -0400, GeorgeB <nospam@att.net> wrote:

>I'm not arguing with MOST ... indeed, probalby over 99% based on
>pupulation density. However, I (Alltel subscriber) and 2 business
>associates (one Verizon, one Cingular) were together on a trip last
>week into northwestern NC, just west of I77. Cingular had nothing at
>all. Verizon (AC2 plan) lost coverage about 2 miles from our
>destination. I, with analog (old Startac) had coverage for the day at
>the customer in Ronda NC, 4 miles from I77. Some of it was CDMA (SID
>309, I believe; I looked and forgot to write it down) but they are not
>on the AC2 list (indeed, not on the National Freedom plan, either), I
>had a solid Rm, a less and less common situation. Total Freedom lacks
>some nice features, but it is the best I've seen at working
>everywhere. I'm not sure if it is available to new subscribers.

Hmm.. I plan on being in that area in about 6 weeks. I'll have to see
about that too. I have an old V60 with an AC I PRL, and my new V325
with an AC II PRL.

I know that SID 309 (Roanoke/Radford area) is digital at least where
I've used it, but out in the boonies, you'll see phones go to analog.
Madison county in Virginia off of US Route 29 is one such example
(Alltel SID 424).

>I prefer the term dual mode, dual band ... and will not, by choice, be
>without it. The main reason I still have the StarTac is the higher
>transmit power on analog, although battery life is short in that
>situation. I keep a battery on charge in the car ...

Keep that StarTac as long as you can. Great phone.

>One of these days, I'll have to downgrade to a new phone, but it will
>be an unhappy day. I see areas of analog 2 or 3 times a week now.

I'm not that happy with the V325. Just not as good as my older V120c,
V120e or V60s phones I've had in the past.

Dave

 

On Mon, 28 Aug 2006 17:26:38 -0400, Diamond Dave
<dmine45.NOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote:

>I know that SID 309 (Roanoke/Radford area) is digital at least where
>I've used it, but out in the boonies, you'll see phones go to analog.
>Madison county in Virginia off of US Route 29 is one such example
>(Alltel SID 424).

My memory is probably bad. I don't get solid roam on any Verizon or
Alltel. Four or five times a year drive up 77 to 81, have the range
of solid roam and/or analog from (MEMORY) 30 miles into NC to 10 miles
into NC. Then I get the 81 towers whihc would be the SID 309, I
suspect.

I see less and less analog, but there are still areas where it is the
only game in town.

 

There are only two bands of frequencies for wireless telephony:
800-900 MHtz (Old Cellular - 1980s) and 1800-1900 MHtz (PCS - Personal
Communications Service - 1990s vintage) . So the most any phone can
have is TWO BANDS.

Due to mergers and acquisitions, most carriers are using both bands
nationwide. For example, Verizon is cellular in most of the old Bell
Atlantic areas while it is PCS in Cincy Ohio. Cingular is Cellular in
Atlanta but PCS in the Carolina's.

Note there is one additional band and it is for Sat Phones (InMarSat).

As far as modes go, there are several modes. Most are carrier and
roaming partner specific.

AMPS - Advanced Mobile Phone Service = a signaling system developed in
the USA in the 1960s for use by the old Bell System for mobile
telephony in the 150-160 MHtz and 460 MHtz bands. In today's cellular
world, it is also called ANALOG
TDMA- a precursor to GSM
CDMA - a digital encoding system used by Sprint and Verizon and its
bed (raoming) partners
IDEN - a digital encoding system used by Nextel.
GSM - a digital encoding system used by almost everyone else like
Cingular and T-Mobile

ANALYSIS

In the States, a phone sold in a carrier's store cannot work on more
than the two frequency bands (800-900 MHtz (Old Cellular - 1980s) and
1800-1900 MHtz (PCS - Personal Communications Service - 1990s
vintage)).

A phone typically only works in one MODE. The mode is what ever the
carrier and its roaming partners are engineered for like CDMA, GSM,
Analog, etc. A few phones are designed to do a digital encoding as
well as fall back to analog.

They would technically be called DUAL MODE because they communicate
with the wireless network via a digital mode or analog mode. This can
be a big Safety PLUS for people who travel in rurual areas where MOM &
POP local wireless companies have not jumped to digital encoding.

These are the areas where you had service a few years ago but your
carrier said you needed to get a new phone because of IMPROVEMENTS and
you lost coverage areas. Cingulars change from TDMA to pure GSM is an
example of decreasing coverage area with roaming partners while
IMPROVING there own network.

Therefor, if a sales person calls a phone a tri-mode phone, the sales
person has been trained by a person who does not know the basics of
wireless telephony.

BOTTOM LINE
There are two bands and
Most phones are one mode. A few will do two modes.

PRINT THIS AND TAKE IT WITH YOU WHEN YOU SHOP. The sales rep will
probably say: Basically this is correct but to make it easier for the
customer, we mix bands and modes.

 

You're making this overly complicated. You don't need to know "the
wireless industry." You just need to know your carrier. For example,
with Verizon Wireless their "tri-mode" phones operate on AMPS 850, CDMA
850, and CDMA 1900, or, for all that most people care, digital and analog
systems. This is not rocket science, and a thesis is not necessary for
the average customer.

none@none.net wrote in news:5gqaf2510me35nl3dga45tgs8b9g784fts@4ax.com:

> There are only two bands of frequencies for wireless telephony:
> 800-900 MHtz (Old Cellular - 1980s) and 1800-1900 MHtz (PCS - Personal
> Communications Service - 1990s vintage) . So the most any phone can
> have is TWO BANDS.
>
> Due to mergers and acquisitions, most carriers are using both bands
> nationwide. For example, Verizon is cellular in most of the old Bell
> Atlantic areas while it is PCS in Cincy Ohio. Cingular is Cellular in
> Atlanta but PCS in the Carolina's.
>
> Note there is one additional band and it is for Sat Phones (InMarSat).
>
> As far as modes go, there are several modes. Most are carrier and
> roaming partner specific.
>
> AMPS - Advanced Mobile Phone Service = a signaling system developed in
> the USA in the 1960s for use by the old Bell System for mobile
> telephony in the 150-160 MHtz and 460 MHtz bands. In today's cellular
> world, it is also called ANALOG
> TDMA- a precursor to GSM
> CDMA - a digital encoding system used by Sprint and Verizon and its
> bed (raoming) partners
> IDEN - a digital encoding system used by Nextel.
> GSM - a digital encoding system used by almost everyone else like
> Cingular and T-Mobile
>
> ANALYSIS
>
> In the States, a phone sold in a carrier's store cannot work on more
> than the two frequency bands (800-900 MHtz (Old Cellular - 1980s) and
> 1800-1900 MHtz (PCS - Personal Communications Service - 1990s
> vintage)).
>
> A phone typically only works in one MODE. The mode is what ever the
> carrier and its roaming partners are engineered for like CDMA, GSM,
> Analog, etc. A few phones are designed to do a digital encoding as
> well as fall back to analog.
>
> They would technically be called DUAL MODE because they communicate
> with the wireless network via a digital mode or analog mode. This can
> be a big Safety PLUS for people who travel in rurual areas where MOM &
> POP local wireless companies have not jumped to digital encoding.
>
> These are the areas where you had service a few years ago but your
> carrier said you needed to get a new phone because of IMPROVEMENTS and
> you lost coverage areas. Cingulars change from TDMA to pure GSM is an
> example of decreasing coverage area with roaming partners while
> IMPROVING there own network.
>
> Therefor, if a sales person calls a phone a tri-mode phone, the sales
> person has been trained by a person who does not know the basics of
> wireless telephony.
>
> BOTTOM LINE
> There are two bands and
> Most phones are one mode. A few will do two modes.
>
> PRINT THIS AND TAKE IT WITH YOU WHEN YOU SHOP. The sales rep will
> probably say: Basically this is correct but to make it easier for the
> customer, we mix bands and modes.
>

 

Mitchell Regenbogen wrote:
> You're making this overly complicated. You don't need to know "the
> wireless industry." You just need to know your carrier. For example,
> with Verizon Wireless their "tri-mode" phones operate on AMPS 850, CDMA
> 850, and CDMA 1900, or, for all that most people care, digital and analog
> systems. This is not rocket science, and a thesis is not necessary for
> the average customer.
>
> none@none.net wrote in news:5gqaf2510me35nl3dga45tgs8b9g784fts@4ax.com:


Well I for one appreciated the complete and very clear description. Why
anyone would jump someone's case for giving an outstanding tutorial on a
complicated subject is a mystery to me!

John

 

none@none.net wrote:
> There are only two bands of frequencies for wireless telephony:
> 800-900 MHtz (Old Cellular - 1980s) and 1800-1900 MHtz (PCS - Personal
> Communications Service - 1990s vintage) . So the most any phone can
> have is TWO BANDS.
>

Thanks! .. that was very informative.

Esmail

 

"Esmail Bonakdarian" <ebonakDUH@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8biJg.9003$4O4.2513@trnddc02...
> none@none.net wrote:
>> There are only two bands of frequencies for wireless telephony:
>> 800-900 MHtz (Old Cellular - 1980s) and 1800-1900 MHtz (PCS - Personal
>> Communications Service - 1990s vintage) . So the most any phone can
>> have is TWO BANDS.
>>
>
> Thanks! .. that was very informative.

Yep, totally wrong, but very informative.

--
<<< Unlock Your Phone's Potential >>>
<<< www.uselessinfo.org.uk >>>
<<< www.thephonelocker.co.uk >>>
<<< www.gsm-solutions.co.uk >>>

 

Richard Colton wrote:
> "Esmail Bonakdarian" <ebonakDUH@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:8biJg.9003$4O4.2513@trnddc02...
>
>>none@none.net wrote:
>>
>>>There are only two bands of frequencies for wireless telephony:
>>>800-900 MHtz (Old Cellular - 1980s) and 1800-1900 MHtz (PCS - Personal
>>>Communications Service - 1990s vintage) . So the most any phone can
>>>have is TWO BANDS.
>>>
>>
>>Thanks! .. that was very informative.
>
>
> Yep, totally wrong, but very informative.

Really? How so .. (seriously)