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VX4400 and USB cable - Help with drivers!

Discussion in 'alt.cellular.verizon' started by Roger Binns, Jan 1, 2004.

  1. Roger Binns

    Roger Binns Guest

    > This would seem to imply (while keeping all of Pee Pee's other b.s. fully
    > in mind) that v09 (which I've never heard of anyone actually having)
    > corrected whatever the problem is with the Futuredial USB cable/driver.
    >
    > Roger, can you positively either confirm or refute this?


    I am only on V08 so I haven't tried it myself. To my knowledge the odd numbered
    firmware is for USCC, not Verizon. I certainly believe the USB issue can be worked
    around in the firmware. Once I have the update I will confirm.

    Roger



    › See More: VX4400 and USB cable - Help with drivers!
  2. Mike

    Mike Guest

    On Sat, 3 Jan 2004 12:33:53 -0800, "Peter Pan"
    <Marcs1102NOSPAM@Hotmail.com> wrote:

    >Never said he was wrong, and use his web page faq on the 4400 all the time.
    >Just have seen a lot of problems with Bitpim/drivers/cables etc that people
    >get cause the MO kit isn't out for the 4400B yet. (they want it now, so they
    >get what his page says for a 4400 and then bitch when it doesn't work
    >right).


    There is, and will be, no separate Mobile Office Kit for the 4400B.
    There is no need for one, for electronically, the 4400B is the same
    phone as a 4400 with the updated firmware (v10), which I have and use
    frequently with the "regular" Mobile Office Kit for the 4400.

    >Sorry to disappoint you but I own a computer repair/cellphone repair store.
    >Not a friggen Radio Shack, and I'm getting sick and tired of you being such
    >an asshole and keep accusing me of being one of those stupid radio shack
    >jerks. That's the 2nd time you have said that.


    Radio Shack, as you note, has a reputation for uneven sales help.
    Steve Crow, on this newsgroup, is one of the very few RS folks who
    actually has an idea of what he's talking about.

    You've been spouting such misinformation on this thread, you're
    starting to make the average RS sales droid sound experienced!

    >I'm glad all your accessories
    >work for you, I have just personally seen an awful lot of people that come
    >in with old phone/old firmware, bought a new accessory that doesn't work,
    >but have never updated the firmware. If the firmware is exactly the same,
    >then it shouldn't need updating, after all you keep saying they are exactly
    >the same, you must think the firmware doesn't matter.


    You're misreading everything I've said.

    What I am saying is this: The 4400B with v10 firmware is the SAME
    PHONE electronically as the 4400 non-B with the same firmware. Roger
    Binns has even noted that if it was a different phone, the 4400B would
    require a new FCC certification, which IT DOES NOT HAVE. The 4500
    DOES (see PhoneScoop), because it IS a different phone. You don't
    have to get the FCC involved if you change the color of the case, but
    you DO have to get them involved if you change the workings.

    Can you find an FCC registration number for the 4400B that is not the
    same as the 4400? If you find and post it, I'll concede your point.
    But your only "evidence" right now has been people coming into your
    store with non-working data cables on the B. That's anecdotal... not
    factual.

    You've got half the newsgroup telling you you're wrong, but you
    haven't provided any FACTUAL EVIDENCE that you're right.

    Mike
  3. Peter Pan

    Peter Pan Guest

    "Roger Binns" <rogerb@rogerbinns.com> wrote in message
    news:kq2kc1-53a.ln1@home.rogerbinns.com...
    > > The 4400Bs come with v10 because it happened to be the current version

    at
    > > the time of production. My 4400 was made with v06; that did not make it

    a
    > > different model than phones made with v04 or v08.

    >
    > You got the point exactly! Mine came with 04.
    >
    > If it has a different FCC ID, then it is a different phone. Simple as

    that.
    > Peter Pan, kindly post the FCC ID from your magically different phone.
    >
    > Roger
    >
    >


    Sorry, I don't buy that, and could care less about an fcc id (what does that
    have to do with a version anyway?). By you deluded thinking, then if a tv
    for example was given the same number, it would be the same? Or Windows 3.1
    is the same as windows XP? I think your logic is faulty. If the
    software/microcode/firmware (whatever you want to call it) is DIFFERENT,
    then it is different, and not the same.
  4. Peter Pan

    Peter Pan Guest

    "Mike" <inundated9@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:nt0fvv4vemol8dgslr4saq2c02m00dl5gr@4ax.com...
    > On Sat, 3 Jan 2004 12:33:53 -0800, "Peter Pan"
    > <Marcs1102NOSPAM@Hotmail.com> wrote:
    >
    > >Never said he was wrong, and use his web page faq on the 4400 all the

    time.
    > >Just have seen a lot of problems with Bitpim/drivers/cables etc that

    people
    > >get cause the MO kit isn't out for the 4400B yet. (they want it now, so

    they
    > >get what his page says for a 4400 and then bitch when it doesn't work
    > >right).

    >
    > There is, and will be, no separate Mobile Office Kit for the 4400B.
    > There is no need for one, for electronically, the 4400B is the same
    > phone as a 4400 with the updated firmware (v10), which I have and use
    > frequently with the "regular" Mobile Office Kit for the 4400.
    >
    > >Sorry to disappoint you but I own a computer repair/cellphone repair

    store.
    > >Not a friggen Radio Shack, and I'm getting sick and tired of you being

    such
    > >an asshole and keep accusing me of being one of those stupid radio shack
    > >jerks. That's the 2nd time you have said that.

    >
    > Radio Shack, as you note, has a reputation for uneven sales help.
    > Steve Crow, on this newsgroup, is one of the very few RS folks who
    > actually has an idea of what he's talking about.
    >
    > You've been spouting such misinformation on this thread, you're
    > starting to make the average RS sales droid sound experienced!
    >
    > >I'm glad all your accessories
    > >work for you, I have just personally seen an awful lot of people that

    come
    > >in with old phone/old firmware, bought a new accessory that doesn't work,
    > >but have never updated the firmware. If the firmware is exactly the same,
    > >then it shouldn't need updating, after all you keep saying they are

    exactly
    > >the same, you must think the firmware doesn't matter.

    >
    > You're misreading everything I've said.
    >
    > What I am saying is this: The 4400B with v10 firmware is the SAME
    > PHONE electronically as the 4400 non-B with the same firmware. Roger
    > Binns has even noted that if it was a different phone, the 4400B would
    > require a new FCC certification, which IT DOES NOT HAVE. The 4500
    > DOES (see PhoneScoop), because it IS a different phone. You don't
    > have to get the FCC involved if you change the color of the case, but
    > you DO have to get them involved if you change the workings.
    >
    > Can you find an FCC registration number for the 4400B that is not the
    > same as the 4400? If you find and post it, I'll concede your point.
    > But your only "evidence" right now has been people coming into your
    > store with non-working data cables on the B. That's anecdotal... not
    > factual.
    >
    > You've got half the newsgroup telling you you're wrong, but you
    > haven't provided any FACTUAL EVIDENCE that you're right.
    >
    > Mike


    Look who's talking and spouting lies every time his fingers get near a
    keyboard. Do you agree or disagree that different firmware versions work
    differently, cause you claim that they are all exactly the same. And a hint
    here, you do NOT have to get the FCC involved if you change the firmware but
    you can totally change the way the phone works by changing firmware.
  5. Jesse McGrew

    Jesse McGrew Guest

    Peter Pan wrote:

    > Sorry, I don't buy that, and could care less about an fcc id (what does that
    > have to do with a version anyway?). By you deluded thinking, then if a tv
    > for example was given the same number, it would be the same? Or Windows 3.1
    > is the same as windows XP? I think your logic is faulty. If the
    > software/microcode/firmware (whatever you want to call it) is DIFFERENT,
    > then it is different, and not the same.


    The firmware is upgradeable and has always been different in newer
    models as it became available. If you bought a 4400 and it had v6, then
    you bought another 4400 a few months later and it had v8, they are still
    the same model. They were both loaded with the newest software available
    at the time, and you can upgrade the older one to match the newer one.

    Think about the PRL, which is another upgradeable part of the software
    (one you can upgrade over the air). If your phone came with PRL version
    50010, and you upgrade it to 50025 by calling *228, is your phone
    suddenly a different model? Of course not.

    Jesse
  6. Peter Pan

    Peter Pan Guest

    "Jesse McGrew" <jmcgrew@hanshorseprestigepelican.com.remove.animals> wrote
    in message news:3ff78de1$0$18421$a32e20b9@news.nntpservers.com...
    > Peter Pan wrote:
    >
    > > Sorry, I don't buy that, and could care less about an fcc id (what does

    that
    > > have to do with a version anyway?). By you deluded thinking, then if a

    tv
    > > for example was given the same number, it would be the same? Or Windows

    3.1
    > > is the same as windows XP? I think your logic is faulty. If the
    > > software/microcode/firmware (whatever you want to call it) is DIFFERENT,
    > > then it is different, and not the same.

    >
    > The firmware is upgradeable and has always been different in newer
    > models as it became available. If you bought a 4400 and it had v6, then
    > you bought another 4400 a few months later and it had v8, they are still
    > the same model. They were both loaded with the newest software available
    > at the time, and you can upgrade the older one to match the newer one.
    >
    > Think about the PRL, which is another upgradeable part of the software
    > (one you can upgrade over the air). If your phone came with PRL version
    > 50010, and you upgrade it to 50025 by calling *228, is your phone
    > suddenly a different model? Of course not.
    >
    > Jesse


    So what's your point? I never said it was a different model, fcc # etc. Heck
    even the manufacturer doesn't call it a different model, only verizon does.
    If you get what Verizon calls a 4400B than you use a different MO and
    different drivers. The person starting this thread asked for help with
    drivers. He never said what version of firmware he was using, or what
    software he was using. There are different drivers for less than version 9
    and other ones for greater than version 9, and different versions of Mobile
    Office for version less than 9 and versions greater then 9. Since he said he
    got it from Verizon, I asked if he had just the 4400 or the 4400B since the
    drivers are different.

    I'll think about PRL's if you think about computers. Same fcc id, same
    model, but you can put say windows or unix in flashmemory. Knowing which OS
    would be handy to know which programs work and which don't work, and even if
    you can find a program that runs on both, the drivers work differently.
  7. Jesse McGrew

    Jesse McGrew Guest

    Peter Pan wrote:
    > So what's your point? I never said it was a different model, fcc # etc. Heck
    > even the manufacturer doesn't call it a different model, only verizon does.
    > If you get what Verizon calls a 4400B than you use a different MO and
    > different drivers. The person starting this thread asked for help with
    > drivers. He never said what version of firmware he was using, or what
    > software he was using. There are different drivers for less than version 9
    > and other ones for greater than version 9, and different versions of Mobile
    > Office for version less than 9 and versions greater then 9. Since he said he
    > got it from Verizon, I asked if he had just the 4400 or the 4400B since the
    > drivers are different.


    Well, others have said that the same cable and drivers can be used on
    version 6-8 and version 10. (I hope they're right, because my 4400 is v6
    and I'm going to get it flashed to v10.)

    Jesse
  8. Peter Pan

    Peter Pan Guest

    "Jesse McGrew" <jmcgrew@hanshorseprestigepelican.com.remove.animals> wrote
    in message news:3ff79e95$0$18403$a32e20b9@news.nntpservers.com...
    > Peter Pan wrote:
    > > So what's your point? I never said it was a different model, fcc # etc.

    Heck
    > > even the manufacturer doesn't call it a different model, only verizon

    does.
    > > If you get what Verizon calls a 4400B than you use a different MO and
    > > different drivers. The person starting this thread asked for help with
    > > drivers. He never said what version of firmware he was using, or what
    > > software he was using. There are different drivers for less than version

    9
    > > and other ones for greater than version 9, and different versions of

    Mobile
    > > Office for version less than 9 and versions greater then 9. Since he

    said he
    > > got it from Verizon, I asked if he had just the 4400 or the 4400B since

    the
    > > drivers are different.

    >
    > Well, others have said that the same cable and drivers can be used on
    > version 6-8 and version 10. (I hope they're right, because my 4400 is v6
    > and I'm going to get it flashed to v10.)
    >
    > Jesse


    Of course you can use the same cable and drivers for what you did before.
    It's only with certain cables/drivers if you try and do new things that are
    possible now with the update, that problems happen. The usual scenario is
    something like when you upgrade to V10, the 1x system can be used for things
    like GIN, if you already have or add 1x to your account, and try and use it
    for data, that's when problems can occur. Most people that come in for
    problems, see the change in icons when sending/receiving data and figure oh
    wow... I'm gonna try high speed connections now, that's when problems seem
    to occur. If you don't try using new things, you should have no problems.
  9. Roger Binns

    Roger Binns Guest

    > There are different drivers for less than version 9
    > and other ones for greater than version 9, and different versions of Mobile
    > Office for version less than 9 and versions greater then 9. Since he said he
    > got it from Verizon, I asked if he had just the 4400 or the 4400B since the
    > drivers are different.


    That is founded on a misinterpretation. I can believe they did some USB stuff in
    the firmware update to v10. I don't have it yet, so I can't confirm behavioural
    differences yet. I would also expect that if someone had some software that
    depended on a bug fix in the firmware, then they would say they need the newer
    version of the firmware.

    Now if you get a 4400B, you know that it has at least v10. 4400 have 04 or
    above depending on when they were purchased, and if the owner took them in
    for an update. It can also take quite a long for the Verizon stores to get
    the updates (up to several months after the initial release).

    As for different drivers, which company are you on about? The VX4400 and
    the VX6000 use exactly the same USB vendor and product ids. The first
    two USB interfaces are a standard AT command protocol. The third interface
    is a trivial bulk data one. There isn't any work there that differs from
    boilerplate.

    LG used to get their drivers written by MCCI. They then brought them in-house.
    You can get those drivers in the Mobile Office Kit and they work around the
    4400 USB issue.

    FutureDial picked up the original MCCI drivers, but they do not work around the USB
    issue, and FutureDial did not get them updated.

    I haven't analysed anyone elses drivers.

    The phonebook protocol and data layout is also identical on the 4400 and 6000.

    There is basically no need for LG or the MOB to have new drivers, since the
    existinging ones work with ANY revision of the phone firmware.

    If there has been a fix in the firmware v10 that alleviates the USB issue,
    then I can see FutureDial claiming to support the 4400B only. That way
    they don't have to worry about firmware, and most users of the 4400 will
    already have picked a cable and software solution. It gets rid of support
    calls/issues by only claiming to support the 4400B.

    Roger
  10. JDC

    JDC Guest

    Odd as it may seem, the the Futer Dial cable to get is the cable for the LG
    VX1, not the the usb cable for the 4400. The 4400 straight usb cable will
    work with a lot of rebooting but is not reliable. There is a bug in the
    4400's software that causes this problem. The serial digital cable for the
    VX1 works just fine.

    Download the drivers off of the Future Dial site. Roger Binn's 4400 FAQ
    mentioned in an earlier part opf this thread details the process well. I
    followed it and have no problems using bitpim, which is a free piece of
    software available off the yahoo 4400 group in their files section.

    You don't need the Motorola mobile office kit.

    By the way, I did all this with the 4400B.




    "ModernMiko" <modernmiko@NOverizon.net> wrote in message
    news:39kJb.39557$E17.10044@nwrddc02.gnilink.net...
    > "Peter Pan" <Marcs1102NOSPAM@Hotmail.com> wrote in message
    > news:bt3bpr$2obuq$1@ID-190045.news.uni-berlin.de...
    > >
    > > "Mike" <inundated9@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    > > news:q0u9vv00gvf32tkikjl6tbp51tiabpe49q@4ax.com...
    > > > On Thu, 1 Jan 2004 18:24:29 -0800, "Peter Pan"
    > > > <Marcs1102NOSPAM@Hotmail.com> wrote:
    > > >
    > > > >That seems to be where a lot of confusion comes about. There is a

    4400
    > > and a
    > > > >4400B. Most places sell the 4400B now but call it just a 4400. While

    > > that
    > > > >is an excellent reference for the older 4400, it's isn't quite right

    > for
    > > the
    > > > >"B" or the one that is being sold nowadays.
    > > >
    > > > This is incorrect, as far as I know. I believe the 4400B is basically
    > > > just a 4400 with a blue outer case and v10 firmware, unless someone
    > > > else has some other information...
    > > >
    > > > Mike

    > >
    > > For a start Try LG Electronics
    > > Phonescoop
    > > Verizon itself (they have both the 4400 and 4400B and tech specs for

    both)
    > >
    > > By the way the case itself isn't a different color, it's just the sticky
    > > plastic sheet on the front to protect it in shipping. The 4400 sheet is
    > > clear, and the b has a blue tinted sheet stuck on it. If someone pulls

    it
    > > off theres no easy way to tell the difference externally.between the

    two.
    >
    > Wrong. I have a 4400 and 4400B and there is *definitely* a difference
    > between the two casings. There are also some slight differences between

    the
    > two on the inside flip (chrome vs. non-chrome around the inner LCD e.g.).
    >
    > --
    > Jenn
    > DS 06/26/98
    > 1 tiny angel 11/03
    >
    > --
    > Leader of the Cult of Worshippers of BiPolar Long-Haired Sexy Anime Guys
    > with Swords
    >
    >
  11. Slope

    Slope Guest

    Problem fixed! The fact of the matter is that the 4400B doesn't work
    with the FutureDial straight USB cable. There is some issue with
    reading the phone book. However, you can use FutureDial's USB/Serial
    cable designed for the VX1 (Part number 170-0783), FutureDial's
    drivers, and BitPim. It works like a charm!!

    Steve





    On Fri, 02 Jan 2004 01:18:59 GMT, www.ttdown.com <ihaveone@home.com>
    wrote:

    >I have a VX4400 with S/W version 10. I purchased the FutureDial USB
    >cable at Radio Shack but cannot get any drivers to work. I have XP on
    >laptop and Win 2K on desktop. Any suggestions?
    >
    >Thanks,
    >Steve
  12. Mike

    Mike Guest

    On Sat, 3 Jan 2004 20:20:26 -0800, "Peter Pan"
    <Marcs1102NOSPAM@Hotmail.com> wrote:

    >I'll think about PRL's if you think about computers. Same fcc id, same
    >model, but you can put say windows or unix in flashmemory. Knowing which OS
    >would be handy to know which programs work and which don't work, and even if
    >you can find a program that runs on both, the drivers work differently.


    This is your problem in a nutshell.

    You emphatically stated that the 4400B was "a different phone" and
    that it did not work with certain cables or drivers.

    The problem is this: The 4400B is no different from the 4400. There
    may or may not be problems with updated firmware, but the 4400B with
    v10 firmware is THE EXACT SAME PHONE as my 4400 (non-B) with v10
    firmware. It's not the "B", it's the firmware, if there is a problem
    at all!

    And as I've noted more than once, I am using the "4400" Mobile Office
    Kit, the original version, out before the B hit stores, with NO
    PROBLEM AT ALL on my 4400 with v10. Once again, my 4400 with v10 is
    the EXACT SAME PHONE as a 4400B with v10. I used this combination
    DAILY for hours a day when waiting for my cable modem to be installed.

    I'm also using the FutureDial USB-to-Serial cable (the one meant for
    the VX1/10) on my 4400 with v10 and have no problems. I don't know
    anything about the "straight" FutureDial USB cable.

    Once again with feeling:

    4400B with v10 = 4400 with v10

    And this is a very important point - there were reports, early on, of
    people who got 4400B's with v8. The v10 is only endemic to the 4400B
    in that it's the most recent firmware version when/shortly after the
    phone came out.

    Mike
  13. David S

    David S Guest

    On Sat, 3 Jan 2004 19:48:05 -0800, "Peter Pan"
    <Marcs1102NOSPAM@Hotmail.com> chose to add this to the great equation of
    life, the universe, and everything:

    >"Mike" <inundated9@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    >news:nt0fvv4vemol8dgslr4saq2c02m00dl5gr@4ax.com...
    >> On Sat, 3 Jan 2004 12:33:53 -0800, "Peter Pan"
    >> <Marcs1102NOSPAM@Hotmail.com> wrote:
    >>
    >> >Never said he was wrong, and use his web page faq on the 4400 all the

    >time.
    >> >Just have seen a lot of problems with Bitpim/drivers/cables etc that

    >people
    >> >get cause the MO kit isn't out for the 4400B yet. (they want it now, so

    >they
    >> >get what his page says for a 4400 and then bitch when it doesn't work
    >> >right).

    >>
    >> There is, and will be, no separate Mobile Office Kit for the 4400B.
    >> There is no need for one, for electronically, the 4400B is the same
    >> phone as a 4400 with the updated firmware (v10), which I have and use
    >> frequently with the "regular" Mobile Office Kit for the 4400.
    >>
    >> >Sorry to disappoint you but I own a computer repair/cellphone repair

    >store.
    >> >Not a friggen Radio Shack, and I'm getting sick and tired of you being

    >such
    >> >an asshole and keep accusing me of being one of those stupid radio shack
    >> >jerks. That's the 2nd time you have said that.

    >>
    >> Radio Shack, as you note, has a reputation for uneven sales help.
    >> Steve Crow, on this newsgroup, is one of the very few RS folks who
    >> actually has an idea of what he's talking about.
    >>
    >> You've been spouting such misinformation on this thread, you're
    >> starting to make the average RS sales droid sound experienced!
    >>
    >> >I'm glad all your accessories
    >> >work for you, I have just personally seen an awful lot of people that

    >come
    >> >in with old phone/old firmware, bought a new accessory that doesn't work,
    >> >but have never updated the firmware. If the firmware is exactly the same,
    >> >then it shouldn't need updating, after all you keep saying they are

    >exactly
    >> >the same, you must think the firmware doesn't matter.

    >>
    >> You're misreading everything I've said.
    >>
    >> What I am saying is this: The 4400B with v10 firmware is the SAME
    >> PHONE electronically as the 4400 non-B with the same firmware. Roger
    >> Binns has even noted that if it was a different phone, the 4400B would
    >> require a new FCC certification, which IT DOES NOT HAVE. The 4500
    >> DOES (see PhoneScoop), because it IS a different phone. You don't
    >> have to get the FCC involved if you change the color of the case, but
    >> you DO have to get them involved if you change the workings.
    >>
    >> Can you find an FCC registration number for the 4400B that is not the
    >> same as the 4400? If you find and post it, I'll concede your point.
    >> But your only "evidence" right now has been people coming into your
    >> store with non-working data cables on the B. That's anecdotal... not
    >> factual.
    >>
    >> You've got half the newsgroup telling you you're wrong, but you
    >> haven't provided any FACTUAL EVIDENCE that you're right.

    >
    >Look who's talking and spouting lies every time his fingers get near a
    >keyboard. Do you agree or disagree that different firmware versions work
    >differently, cause you claim that they are all exactly the same. And a hint


    No one disagrees that different firmware versions work differently. We do
    disagree that a 4400B is a different phone than the 4400 just because it
    comes from the factory with v10 in it.

    What we're saying is, **a 4400 flashed with v10 works exactly the same as a
    4400B that shipped with v10**. In your mind, is that a true statement, yes
    or no?

    >here, you do NOT have to get the FCC involved if you change the firmware but
    >you can totally change the way the phone works by changing firmware.


    I don't know, but I wouldn't be surprised if they have to send it in to the
    FCC for review.

    --
    David Streeter, "an internet god" -- Dave Barry
    http://home.att.net/~dwstreeter
    Expect a train on ANY track at ANY time.
    "If the United States is attacked, file this page in book III of FPM
    Supplement 990-1, in front of part 771. Effective upon an attack on the
    United States and until further notice: a. Part 771 is suspended."
    - Federal Personnel Manual, Manual Supplement 990-3, Civil Service
    Commission
  14. David S

    David S Guest

    On Sat, 3 Jan 2004 20:20:26 -0800, "Peter Pan"
    <Marcs1102NOSPAM@Hotmail.com> chose to add this to the great equation of
    life, the universe, and everything:

    >"Jesse McGrew" <jmcgrew@hanshorseprestigepelican.com.remove.animals> wrote
    >in message news:3ff78de1$0$18421$a32e20b9@news.nntpservers.com...
    >> Peter Pan wrote:
    >>
    >> > Sorry, I don't buy that, and could care less about an fcc id (what does

    >that
    >> > have to do with a version anyway?). By you deluded thinking, then if a

    >tv
    >> > for example was given the same number, it would be the same? Or Windows

    >3.1
    >> > is the same as windows XP? I think your logic is faulty. If the
    >> > software/microcode/firmware (whatever you want to call it) is DIFFERENT,
    >> > then it is different, and not the same.

    >>
    >> The firmware is upgradeable and has always been different in newer
    >> models as it became available. If you bought a 4400 and it had v6, then
    >> you bought another 4400 a few months later and it had v8, they are still
    >> the same model. They were both loaded with the newest software available
    >> at the time, and you can upgrade the older one to match the newer one.
    >>
    >> Think about the PRL, which is another upgradeable part of the software
    >> (one you can upgrade over the air). If your phone came with PRL version
    >> 50010, and you upgrade it to 50025 by calling *228, is your phone
    >> suddenly a different model? Of course not.

    >
    >So what's your point? I never said it was a different model, fcc # etc. Heck
    >even the manufacturer doesn't call it a different model, only verizon does.
    >If you get what Verizon calls a 4400B than you use a different MO and
    >different drivers. The person starting this thread asked for help with
    >drivers. He never said what version of firmware he was using, or what
    >software he was using. There are different drivers for less than version 9
    >and other ones for greater than version 9, and different versions of Mobile
    >Office for version less than 9 and versions greater then 9. Since he said he
    >got it from Verizon, I asked if he had just the 4400 or the 4400B since the
    >drivers are different.


    Let's review. Here is your first post (the third overall) in this thread:

    >That seems to be where a lot of confusion comes about. There is a 4400 and a
    >4400B. Most places sell the 4400B now but call it just a 4400. While that
    >is an excellent reference for the older 4400, it's isn't quite right for the
    >"B" or the one that is being sold nowadays.
    >
    >"Mark W. McClure" <mrkmcclure@excite.com> wrote in message
    >news:8hk9vvg8udc9llarscnq5d7cnrlsqhrk5o@4ax.com...
    >>
    >> Read the FAQ and then see if you have any questions...
    >> http://www.rogerbinns.com/vx4400/vx4400faq.html
    >>
    >> www.ttdown.com <ihaveone@home.com> wrote:
    >>
    >> >I have a VX4400 with S/W version 10. I purchased the FutureDial USB
    >> >cable at Radio Shack but cannot get any drivers to work. I have XP on
    >> >laptop and Win 2K on desktop. Any suggestions?


    So we can see that the OP *did* in fact say what version he was using, and
    you never asked him anything. You just came out and said Roger's faq is
    wrong for the 4400B. While the section on Futuredial drivers may be
    outdated now (and that is something that is still up in the air, AFAIAC),
    you sound like the whole web page is worthless for a B owner. My own very
    brief experience showed no problem with the USB cable; someone else said
    they did have a problem.

    Now, if someone called your shop and said the drivers didn't work on his
    4400 and you asked him if was a B or not and he said no, presumably you
    would tell him something different than if he said yes. But that is a
    stupid question to ask him because it ignores the possibilities that A: he
    has a 4400 that's been upgraded to v10, or B: he has one of those very
    first 4400Bs that shipped with v08. Get a lot of repeat business, do you?

    >I'll think about PRL's if you think about computers. Same fcc id, same
    >model, but you can put say windows or unix in flashmemory. Knowing which OS
    >would be handy to know which programs work and which don't work, and even if
    >you can find a program that runs on both, the drivers work differently.


    Which is why tech support always asks for your OS and its version. If I
    were to wipe my hard drive tomorrow and install Unix, the fact that I have
    a Powerspec 8250 with a Pentium 4 at 1.4 Mhz would still be just as true as
    it is now. Sure, it would work differently, but it would be the same
    hardware.

    --
    David Streeter, "an internet god" -- Dave Barry
    http://home.att.net/~dwstreeter
    Expect a train on ANY track at ANY time.
    "See, the problem is that God gives men a brain and a penis, and only
    enough blood to run one at a time." - Robin Williams and/or Dave Barry
  15. Peter Pan

    Peter Pan Guest

    "David S" <dwstreeter@att.net> wrote in message
    news:kurhvvk7dh9l3tqov52mcqksqj7cb3k9l4@4ax.com...
    >
    > No one disagrees that different firmware versions work differently. We do
    > disagree that a 4400B is a different phone than the 4400 just because it
    > comes from the factory with v10 in it.
    >
    > What we're saying is, **a 4400 flashed with v10 works exactly the same as

    a
    > 4400B that shipped with v10**. In your mind, is that a true statement, yes
    > or no?
    >


    Of course it does, but both are listed on the verizon site separately, the
    options are (slightly) different on those pages, most people that we see
    don't bother to upgrade their firmware (they just get something at RS/from a
    friend/or download things off the web) and expect them to work, and in our
    parts catalog the accessories have different order numbers. The service
    problem usually comes about when someone has an old 4400 or a new 4400B and
    tries to use 3rd party cables/software as if it was a 4400, and many don't
    bother to upgrade the firmware on old phones..

    Like I said, most things work fine, heck people don't bring it in for
    service unless something doesn't work, and Roger even posted the following:
    <start Paste>
    LG used to get their drivers written by MCCI. They then brought them
    in-house.
    You can get those drivers in the Mobile Office Kit and they work around the
    4400 USB issue.

    FutureDial picked up the original MCCI drivers, but they do not work around
    the USB
    issue, and FutureDial did not get them updated.
    <end paste>

    You will notice above that if you have the mobile office kit it works
    correctly, but not always if you have 3rd party stuff. Since the MO kit for
    the 4400B isn't readily available yet, many people we see have 3rd party
    stuff.

    The original poster had asked about the "4400 and USB cable - Help with
    drivers". I had asked if it was a 4400 or 4400B, if a 4400 then there are
    mobile office kits readily available, if a 4400B they won't generally be
    available until next week. If in a hurry he could get 3rd party things, but
    they may not work exactly like the mobile office kit in some situations.

    Back to your statement, why does the Verizon web page (go to
    http://www.verizonwireless.com click on products, then accessories, a menu
    appears and under LG, in the drop down box, they list both the VX4400 and
    the VX4400B, if you select one or the other, different accessories are
    shown.) show them and have separate options unless they consider them
    different?.
  16. Mike

    Mike Guest

    On Mon, 5 Jan 2004 00:27:07 -0800, "Peter Pan"
    <Marcs1102NOSPAM@Hotmail.com> wrote:

    >The original poster had asked about the "4400 and USB cable - Help with
    >drivers". I had asked if it was a 4400 or 4400B, if a 4400 then there are
    >mobile office kits readily available, if a 4400B they won't generally be
    >available until next week. If in a hurry he could get 3rd party things, but
    >they may not work exactly like the mobile office kit in some situations.


    Man, are you dense!!!!

    Let's walk through this again. Slowly, since you seem to need it:

    * THERE IS OR WILL BE NO VZW MOBILE OFFICE KIT SPECIFICALLY DESIGNED
    FOR THE 4400B!

    You are ignoring one very important fact, which we've told you roughly
    20 times now.

    A) There are 4400s with flashed v10 software, mine included. I don't
    know how many folks have done it, but I'd imagine there's at least a
    few if folks were having firmware issues (i.e. the pre-v8 tendency to
    bounce back and forth between digital and analog signals). If they
    had, say, a v6 and wanted to fix these issues, THEY WOULD GET v10, not
    v8, since v10 is the current version! Bingo... you've got a 4400
    non-B owner with the latest firmware.

    B) As noted here at least three times, early 4400B's shipped with v8.
    Does that make them a "different phone" from the 4400B's which ship
    with v10? The "B" is only shipping with different firmware because
    THAT IS THE CURRENT VERSION OF THE 4400 FIRMWARE! If you'd started
    this thread with "hey, there could be some third party USB driver
    problems with the latest 4400's, including Bs and those with v10
    firmware", you'd have been correct (assuming such an issue exists) and
    we wouldn't have "piled on you". But no...they're "different phones".
    You're too hung up on the "B"!

    C) Again, this assumes there is even such an issue attached to the v10
    firmware which resides in most 4400B's, and in 4400's like mine which
    have been flashed. If you're talking about the FutureDial straight
    USB cable, I can't help there. But I have the FutureDial
    USB-to-serial cable and the "old" Mobile Office Kit for the 4400,
    working fine on my v10 4400. Since it is ELECTRONICALLY IDENTICAL to
    the 4400B's with v10, there should be NO problem with these two items
    working on the 4400B's with v10 and there should be NO reason to
    "update" the MOK. But that's an issue I'll leave to Roger. Even if
    there IS a reason re: v10...it affects both 4400's and B's with v10.
    Period.

    The big point here is (man, I feel like I'm talking to a wall here):
    If there are issues re: MOK, it's a v10 issue, not a B issue. And the
    presence of 4400B's with v8 early in the production cycle would
    indicate to me that VZW only intended to put out the B for cosmetic
    reasons. If they were still making non-B's, they'd have v10, too!

    >Back to your statement, why does the Verizon web page (go to
    >http://www.verizonwireless.com click on products, then accessories, a menu
    >appears and under LG, in the drop down box, they list both the VX4400 and
    >the VX4400B, if you select one or the other, different accessories are
    >shown.) show them and have separate options unless they consider them
    >different?.


    I haven't compared each accessory on each page, but it appears we're
    talking the same accessories in different order on the page! And
    they'll all work on each phone. For one, all the headsets have 2.5mm
    jacks, and will work on any phone with a 2.5mm jack, including both
    the 4400 and the B!

    And not even THIS statement from the 4400B's description on the VZW
    Web site will convince you that the change in the B was cosmetic:

    "Introduce yourself to the new VX4400B from LG. You'll find the same
    mix of impressive features and functions as the popular VX4400, but
    with a fresh new look."

    ::sigh::

    I give up. Nothing I can say will convince you. Nothing Roger Binns
    says will convince you. You win! It's a different phone! Entirely
    different! We're all wrong!

    Goodbye!

    Mike

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